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Sean Hollister

Sean Hollister

Senior Editor

Senior Editor

    More From Sean Hollister

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Overheard: “Maybe we get there, maybe we won’t, but at least you and I tried.”

    Epic lead attorney Gary Bornstein to Google lead attorney Glenn Pomerantz, as they walked back into the courtroom together.

    Both were chatting in the hall; it’s not out of the ordinary for the two parties’ attorneys to get friendly from what I’ve seen. But the judge has also sometimes sent them explicitly to work something out re: witnesses, sealing, or scheduling. Do they have an idea to present Judge Donato after the break?

    Update: Not yet; Judge Donato brought out the jury. Bornstein says he’s working out something with Google about playing a pair of video depositions, though.

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    What we didn’t hear: does Spotify have special deals on Apple, Xbox and PlayStation too?

    One would think so: we know Xbox handed out many policy exceptions for streaming apps, and I bet some astute reader can figure out which of the ones at my link is Spotify.

    We’re on break now, and Spotify’s deposition is done, without returning to the Coalition for App Fairness at all. What might we see when we return?

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Spotify: “We have never been forced by Google to accept Play Billing.”

    Alzetta says that unlike with many other companies, Google didn’t make its own payment system mandatory for Spotify to adopt — the very first time Google approached Spotify about adding Google Play Billing, it was with a proposal in hand.

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Spotify: “We are not going to pay a commission of 30 percent. Our business does not allow for that.”

    Spotify’s Sandra Alzetta says it’s against the company’s “principles,” too, and that “strategically,” Spotify simply won’t do it, full stop.

    Alzetta says Spotify has been forced to raise its prices over the years: “We had to increase our prices to consumer. We had to increase them significantly. That is not a good thing for a consumer.”

    It is true that Spotify has rarely turned a profit; it generally prioritizes growth, which gives it the scale to broker deals like the zero-percent arrangement with Google.

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Epic didn’t probe on the Coalition for App Fairness. Will Google?

    We’re hearing a lot of assertions how hard Spotify has worked to build its own payment system and how important choice is to users (Alzetta says “we know that” choice results in increased conversion rates), but there was only a passing mention of the Coalition for App Fairness, a controversial lobbying group which, I revealed in 2021, was set up explicitly by Epic Games to help win its case.

    It’s pretty rich to be a member of the Coalition for App Fairness and also work out a secret zero percent deal with Google that you want to keep hidden, isn’t it?

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Epic is closing the net around Google’s argument that Play is more than payments.

    We are looking at a line in the actual agreement between Google and Spotify where Spotify made out like a bandit compared to other Android developers. It reads:

    The program fees are payable on account of Google Play’s billing system services.

    Epic’s lawyer asks: what about distribution? (Google has argued that Play provides massive scale distribution, security, and many other features in exchange for the fee.)

    Spotify’s Alzetta says no — Spotify is only paying Google for payment processing. There were also “some commitments with regard to product” and a “marketing success fund” as part of the deal, but that’s it.

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    “If a user chooses to use Spotify for its payment method, there is no fee paid to Google.”

    Spotify’s Sandra Alzetta is the one who brokered the secret deal, we’re learning — and she just confirmed in no uncertain terms what we learned yesterday about Google’s zero percent sweetheart deal for Spotify.

    If users choose Google Play Billing to pay for Spotify, she says, Spotify only pays to cover Google’s cost to process the payment.

    A secret Google deal let Spotify completely bypass Android’s app store fees

    Adi Robertson and Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    We’re done with Amazon’s Donn Morrill and on to Spotify’s Sandra Alzetta.

    Judge James Donato is telling the jury that they will see more details about Spotify that won’t be revealed in public court. It’s the second time we’ve done that in this case — but the previous secret numbers eventually did get unsealed, revealing that Spotify had a secret deal to pay effectively nothing to Google for the Play Store.

    Sandra Alzetta is Spotify’s head of commerce. We’re watching a video deposition from September 2022.

    A secret Google deal let Spotify completely bypass Android’s app store fees

    Adi Robertson and Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    In 2021, Amazon internally admitted it goofed on teaching users how to sideload.

    Amazon’s top recommendation to improve the Amazon Appstore in 2021 was to fix its installation instructions — because they were at least slightly wrong for phones as popular as the Samsung Galaxy S20.

    However, the picture under “Turn on Unknown Sources” did not match the settings for numerous Android phones we tested (LG K30, Galaxy S9, Samsung Galaxy S20, Pixel 3, ASUS Zenfone Max [...])

    Also, Google is pointing out that Amazon Fire tablets included sideloading scare screens as well:

    Your tablet and personal data are more vulnerable to attack by unknown apps. By installing apps from this source, you agree that you are responsible for any damage to your tablet or loss of data that may result from their use.

    Guess sideloading friction wasn’t just Google’s fault?

    As of 2021, “Amazon had significantly fewer apps (456k) than Apple (1.85m) or Google (2.65m)” according to an Amazon doc.

    Sean Hollister
    Sean Hollister
    Was the Amazon Appstore’s lack of success an Amazon problem or a Google problem?

    I’m beginning to wonder, as we zip through an internal Amazon document from April 23rd, 2013 that identifies early strengths and weaknesses across various app stores. Are these things really Google’s fault?

    Amazon received app updates later than Google

    Amazon had outdated versions of some Amazon subsidiary apps compared to Google

    Amazon was missing many key apps for non-Kindle [...]

    Apple and Google’s merchandised content had a more curated and editorial feel

    Kindle versions of some racing games appeared to have lower-quality graphics than Google or Apple versions.

    Amazon provided limited personalized recommendations

    Google and Apple provided more full and consistent app data

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