As if you needed more reason to love Carly Rae Jepsen’s “Call Me Maybe” beyond its pop perfection, it is also, according to lore, the genesis for Switched on Pop, one of the best music podcasts out there. Cohosts Nate Sloan and Charlie Harding obsessively dissect pop songs, from the theory behind their musical choices to their production techniques. If you’re a student of pop music, then this is a must-listen podcast.

Sloan is a composer and professor of musicology at USC Thornton School of Music, where he researches pop, but also jazz and even Tin Pan Alley. Harding is a songwriter, music journalist, and a professor as well. Their combined knowledge is near encyclopedic. Whether they’re talking about text painting in Justin Timberlake’s “Can’t Stop the Feeling!” or Taryn Southern’s AI experiments, the two reveal the rich tapestry of even the most simple-seeming songs.

Now, after 12 years and nearly 500 episodes, the show recently made the leap to video on Netflix, featuring guests like Aaron Dessner (The National), Trevor Horn (The Buggles, Yes), and Cypress Hill. Sloan and Harding told us about the importance of the metronome, fresh vegetables, and what seems to be a slightly problematic relationship with guitar pedals.

Switched on Pop is a production of New York Magazine’s Vulture and the Vox Media Podcast Network.

What is your most indispensable tool?

Charlie Harding: The Martin D-28 is the platonic idea of both what a guitar sounds like and, I’m ashamed to admit how much this matters to me, how a guitar looks. You’ve heard it on “Blackbird,” “Wish You Were Here,” and “Big Yellow Taxi.” I found one from 1970 sitting in an antique shop in Maine. But I’m still waiting for it to produce a timeless classic for me.

Nate Sloan: Sibelius music notation software. Whenever I’m analyzing a song, I don’t truly understand it until I transcribe its melody, harmony, and rhythm.

Which is the most underappreciated?

CH: Keyboard shortcuts and the app Rectangle save me hours of my life every year by doing the mundane task of repositioning windows on my computer. And they also make me feel like I’m mission control on some kind of spaceship.

NS: The metronome.

What is the first app you install on a new phone or computer?

NS: AudioHijack for grabbing audio.

What is one thing you wish you could change about your phone?

CH: This is very nitpicky, but it drives me mad. I extensively use focus modes on iOS to help keep away distractions. But I also need people in my family to be able to reach me, so they get exceptions to the focus modes. However, that means any group messaging chain with just one family member blows up my notifications when I’m presenting to a lecture hall full of songwriting students. This means I’m urgently notified every time my recently retired father catches a fish. I am happy for my dad, but I’d be more happy to find out after 5 pm when I’m off “do not disturb.” If this makes me sound like a curmudgeon, I am.

NS: I wish I could strum it like a guitar.

What sites do you have pinned to your tab bar?

NS: ProQuest Historical Newspapers.

How many tabs do you have open right now?

CH: 92… but they are nicely organized into groups that only I understand.

NS: Two. I used to have hundreds open, but it was killing my attention span, so I now make a point of constantly closing them.

Which social media platform do you use the most (if any)?

NS: Instagram, guiltily.

What is your happy place online?

CH: Browsing Sweetwater for variations of guitar pedals that I already own.

NS: Watching ukulele tutorials on YouTube.

What is your favorite gadget you’ve ever owned?

CH: The Dato DUO synthesizer and Dato DRUM drum machine. They are the easiest way to learn to program a synthesizer, and you can’t make a bad sound. My kids jam on them every night. It’s turned them into Brooklyn DJs, unfortunately.

NS: The iPod that I traveled around the world with in 2006.

Which was the most disappointing?

NS: The minidisc player.

What game do you have the fondest memories of?

NS: Pac-Man.

Which tech trend do you wish would go away?

CH: AI music slop, full stop.

NS: Wearable computing.

What is one thing you wish you had created?

CH: In 2007 I pitched my college friends on creating an app that would allow you to legally hitchhike in other people’s cars. We started a tea company instead, which was ultimately less of a liability.

NS: Autotune.

What creation are you most proud of?

CH: Switched On Pop. My wife read this and said I should add my children.

NS: Coining the term “pop drop” to describe the instrumental postchorus in a pop song.

Which are you least proud of?

CH: My wife read this and said I should say my guitar pedal collection.

NS: Getting dunked on by YouTuber Rick Beato after calling the Jonas Brothers “stupefyingly funky” in a New York Times article.

What’s the best piece of advice you’ve ever received?

CH: You can never have too many guitar pedals.

NS: Have a short memory.

What is your current obsession?

NS: LeBron James signing with the 76ers.

What do you do when you need to focus?

CH: Drink some tea.

NS: Step away from the computer, take a walk, and start recording a voicenote about what I’m trying to accomplish.

What do you do when you’re feeling stuck?

CH: Drink some tea.

NS: Call Charlie Harding.

When was the last time you went somewhere without your phone?

CH: During routine surgery.

NS: Whenever I go to the gym.

What’s the last piece of physical media you bought?

CH: The History of Sound by Ben Shattuck.

NS: Vinyl copy of the Jeff Parker IVTet.

What do you think is worth splurging on?

CH: My guitar pedals. And my beautiful wife.

NS: Fresh vegetables.

What would the tagline for your biopic be?

CH: He is embarrassed there is a biopic about him.

NS: One man dared to overanalyze pop music, taking on BTS Army, Madonna stans, and the Little Monsters, and living to tell the tale.

What’s the last GIF or meme you used?

CH:

NS: